October 9, 2025 | 10:41
Stacey: Nice to be here, Dani.
Dani: Let's get right into it. Insurance, for-profit industry, it's a business. Where do you see money being left on the table? And what can be done to address that?
Stacey: I think probably the biggest one of the biggest challenges right now is just around fraud, it's always been a problem. And it's not going to stop being a problem anytime soon. In fact, I was at an event last week where the commissioner for North Carolina was on a panel and they asked him what keeps you up at night. And he said fraud, because actually with all this AI tech, the bad guys are doing it in volume now, volumes that we've never seen. So it's becoming an even bigger problem fueled by technology-
Dani: Fueled by tech, sophisticated technology, opportunistic fraud at levels that we haven't seen before due to, you know, other societal things that are going on. So hearing that the commissioner, like that keeps the commissioner up at night, do you think it's keeping our insurance leaders up at night? Because I ask you that because there seems to be a bit of a, well, you know, 10% of claims are fraudulent and we're still doing business. So like, we'll just kind of keep going. Like, you know, but it's something that has to change. Would love your perspective on that.
Stacey: I mean, combined ratio alone keeps executives up at night, right? And it certainly, you know, loss is a contributing factor. So yeah, I think it's, they don't specifically spend all their days thinking about it. I think a lot of insurance industry leaders tend to be more underwriter focused and underwriting focused, top line and growth, and what the claims leaders, for sure.
Dani: I want to ask you then continue on the fraud aspect. I mean maybe we can talk a bit about the impact on the insurer but also the consumer with you know an increase in fraud and then also what can we do if the system's not necessarily working with this larger level of fraud and volume that's happening?
Stacey: We got to get better at Using up the tools that we have access to.
Dani: What's the, ultimately, and I think this is something I've heard a lot from folks today, talking about, you know, we need to educate our consumers more on what we actually do as insurers so that they understand. What's the impact on the consumer when fraudulent activity continues to happen?
Stacey: Well, prices rise, right? Insurance, you know, I mean, I own houses and cars right so I have to pay these bills too and rates are going up and it gets painful you know if we're all paying for it ultimately.
Dani: with all of this so rates are rising but there's compliance and regulation to think about there there are market caps there's cat events you know there's there's all these different things so things can't keep going exactly the way they they are like the system like there are certain parts it's it's cracking or it's breaking like what what do you think might need to change?
Stacey: I actually have maybe a different angle to go with that. I don't think it needs to change because if you take a look all this increased risk and has been driving premiums. Go look at the stock market. Go look at the stock prices of all the publicly trained insurance companies in the US over the last two years– huge growth. It's been a very positive thing from a revenue and perspective, right? Inflation actually helps insurance. It's kind of weird that way.
Dani: So fair point. And then I want to take us to the customer side for a second here, because obviously there's a perception, you know, so to your point, their growth on the insurance side, which is great for for profit businesses but consumer trust perhaps has taken a hit and so do you do you think we fall in off as an industry there and if so where and what can be done to address it?
Stacey: Insurance is a big word right it means a lot of different things to a lot of different people I tell people I work in insurance and they think I'm doing health care right and it's like okay a lot of people that's what the insurance is for them it's health insurance insurance and the only thing about car insurance when the bill comes right but if they're having help issues they think a lot about health insurance and I'd say you know that's an industry and not the pick on it but it's an industry that I think probably gets a bad rap and in that I mean in P&C, we also aren't angels either. There was a 60 minutes thing last September where they were interviewing people in Florida who still hadn't gotten their claims processed from Hurricane Sandy or something several years ago. And then they went on to talk to you about how adjusters were saying that they sent these reports into the insurance company and the insurance company modified the reports. They took out certain pages, they changed the numbers and they kind of created their own version of the report. And then went back to the insurance and said, "Yeah, you're, you know, a 6 figure loss, "we're gonna give you $14 ,000," right? So it was a really bad image that we got from that. And the thing is, in all So there's bad actors. There's bad things happening. Yeah, we don't like that but when it gets put under a magnifying glass like that, it doesn't help
Dani: Absolutely not and interestingly like those are the only stories that seem to get amplified versus, you know, the net positive outcomes for
Stacey: Yeah you know what the news doesn't talk about they don't seem to talk about social inflation and these lawsuits that are getting, you know, nuclear and thermonuclear now is the new term I've heard, you know, these verdicts that are starting to get upwards of a billion dollars. And, you know, we all pay for that when that happens.
Dani: Yes. And I think that goes back to the point about education so that everyone in the ecosystem can better understand how all these parts work together. And then you know so to your point bad actors everywhere and perhaps the majority of genuine customers But there are some bad actors now going back to that side who you know talked about fraud who are submitted fraudulent claims, Etc. What if there was a way for insurers to more confidently trust the information that they're getting from consumers at the time that they submit a claim like how might that change the way things are done or how would that impact people, process, business?
Stacey: Well, I think if it was trusted information, it still might be fraudulent, right? So it's true information, but a bad claim, right? So that could still happen, I guess. But I think it would certainly make things more efficient, right? If the data was more trusted, I mean, for sure it can help with efficiencies.I don't know that it like I said I don't know that it prevents fraud, but it might reduce it I might if people know that the information they're submitting will be verified, maybe they won't even start the process, right?
Dani: There's a walkaway or withdrawal potential there to acting as of the current factor potentially and so to your point It does sound like there's a bit of a people, a tech, a good data thing that all kind of has to work together here. To wrap us up, let me ask you, Stacy, with your many years of experience and also, you know, you're consulting and all the folks that you talked to, if there's one thing that you would want leaders who are listening to know or something you would implore to them, like Listen to this do this now. What would that be?
Stacey: I know you asked for one thing, but I have two,
Dani: yeah, we'll take two
Stacey: The first one, take rate. Don't be afraid to take rate, take rate, but number two is don't forget about the customer.
Dani: Yeah, tell me more about don't forget about the customer
Stacey: Ultimately there's a number of things we talked about there's the need for education. I think a lot of carriers have gotten better, like I know my small business insurance, I get regular updates and tips and tricks and stuff from my carrier. I'm seeing the industry actually going beyond just collecting premiums and sending a bill once a year. It's starting to get there, but we just need more of that and more education and maybe even younger education. I don't know that insurance is talked about in high school you know. I think students first start getting introduced to it when they get a car and they get their license and that's mom and dad say and you got to pay for your insurance so go get a job right but yeah education and thinking about how we can help consumers be their own best risk management, this mangers.
Dani: Yeah, that's a great point. And actually, to your other point, I did see a study recently that said Gen Z is holding off on buying insurance. Again, perhaps it's a mix of cost, but also education, also wondering how this applies to my particular lifestyle. So to your point, again, there's a kind of holistic process involved in that to let people know like all the ways in which it applies. So great, great takeaway Stacy. Thank you so much for being here.
Stacey: Thanks. Great to be here.